• Capel: If a man can lead a moral life that can suffice.
Spiritual life may involve
the necessity of a Guru, but a man may do without a Guru in
his moral life. Man
understands general moral principles and some persons with
high moral character
are found in the society and a man can adjust his conduct by
observing their
conduct. But there he does not require selling himself
outright to another
particular individual. To surrender one's personality to
another seems to be
extremely self-derogatory.
• Sri Sri Thakur: Everyone of us is begotten by a particular
individual and so we
acknowledge that individual as father; such is the
dispensation of nature. Do we
consider owing allegiance to father as something disgraceful
? Rather, because of
our veneration to one as father, we can pay profound respect
to others who are
like him. Only depending on another suitable integrated
person can unify our
personality. The basis of our life is our life-urge. If the
urge is torn in a hundred
ways, then our personality becomes totally shattered. If we
accept some one as
primary then out of an urge to fulfill him, we may gather
necessary ingredients
from all suitable sources. That causes no harm. Out of this
adherence all
knowledge and experiences of man become tied together on a
common thread to
find a meaningful fulfillment in one. A man may have varied
knowledge,
qualities and experiences but if he has no centre of
fulfillment, then all those
things exist as so many disintegrated lumps. He may observe
moral principles
but they are not assimilated and absorbed and this brings
indigestion of morality.
Again, our urge can not continue intact without having a
definite Superior
Beloved. Man does not observe principles for the sake of
principles, but he
observes them out of an urge to satisfy the Superior
Beloved. If there is no
Superior Beloved, the ardour for observing principles also
diminishes.
• Capel: Why should there be only one Superior Beloved?
There may be many.
• Sri Sri Thakur: It leads man to the same result as is
derived by a woman by
having many husbands instead of one. Uni-centric adjustment can
not take place.
It begets a conflicting personality. So some one should be
prime. If a man's
different organs are generated and developed in different
wombs of different
mothers, can they be fastened to form a single normal living
organism of a man?
Unity evolves into variety and variety becomes meaningful in
unity. In the
beginning there must be a unit. One cell in course of its
division forms so many
organs and evolves into a huge human body. So there exists
such co-ordination
and reciprocity among the different parts of the body. So a
deep sense of harmony
and concord prevails among the different elements of our
knowledge if that
sprouts through adherence to one. Otherwise there subsists
no relation between
one understanding and another in a man. The isolated
understandings create a
confused uproar and do not enrich life by being mutually
fulfilling.
• Capel: How does untottering faith in the existence of God
become steady ? At
times doubt torments my mind.
• Sri Sri Thakur: Love is at the root of faith. When love
for passion supersedes
love for being, doubt becomes prominent instead of faith.
Whenever you begin to
doubt about God, take it for granted that passionate ness
has possessed you. Faith
is enlivening that alone leads man aright and makes him powerful.
Disbelief and
doubt make man unconscientiously and weak. The more our
devotion to Guru
Increases, the more our faith in God becomes firm. And
through spiritual
practices direct experience is to be gained about the
original abode of being. If a
man stands on the bedrock of that realization, then his mind
totters very little. A
man cannot be rooted in faith, till the veil of his
passionate ness is completely
penetrated. Passionate ness creates a false screen that
covers truth. The sun is selfluminous,
but have you not seen how it is often darkened by the
cloud?What has
been described in our scriptures, as the veil of illusion is
perhaps this passionate
ness.
• Capel: Today man cannot do without science, but science is
turning to be a
source of restlessness instead of peace. What is the way
out?
• Sri Sri Thakur: If we cultivate science actuated by a
sense of Dharma, then it will
be our endeavour to harness science to our effective living
along with that of
others. Thereby science will be meaningful to our life
through distribution of
mutual service. The urge to live and let others live is the
religious urge. So this
religious urge has to be awakened. Then the idea of saving
others and not
destroying them will dominate others. And then science will
contribute to peace
instead of disturbance. Along with that there should be
preparedness for selfdefence.
And such ideas are to be propagated among the masses of
different
countries as are sure to intensify within all the urge of
living and letting others
live. Preparation for self-defence is meant for this that no
destructive force may
annihilate existence and integration.
• Capel: There are people who reckon preparation for killing
others as a part of
preparation for self-defence. Because if others realize
that, their attempt to kill us
is sure to bring about their death, then at least that
fright will dissuade them forth
taking aggressive measures and our security will be ensured.
Then the race of
making preparations for self-defence will automatically
bring in violence and war.
• Sri Sri Thakur: The motive-force that should guide us is
to maintain our own
existence without causing any injury to other people, as far
as practicable. We
have no right to allow our existence to be victimized by
others violence, because
existence is the endowment of God.
• Capel: It is said that God cannot be attained without
extinction of desires. But is
desire-less life possible? How can it be possible that no
desire will spring up in
one's mind?
• Sri Sri Thakur: Whatever will may appear, whatever desire
may linger, if their
goal is God, if their sole purpose is to fulfill Him, then
they cause no harm. But
we should not give indulgence to those desires that are
opposed to Him. To
indulge in them is to burden us by carrying unnecessary
loads. Of what use it is to
indulge in that which separates me from my beloved and hurls
me down in the
vortex of afflictions?
• Capel: I have given you lots of trouble. I have profited
much by talking with you.
Let us close here today.
• Sri Sri Thakur: No trouble at all. I like it immensely.
But I am an ignorant man. I
do not know English. Moreover, I do not possess sufficient
knowledge to present
my ideas in a systematic manner.
• Capel: I have read your "The Message", no one
can speak like that without
knowing English.
• Sri Sri Thakur: I do not know anything. Kestoda (Shri
Krishna Prasanna
Bhattacharya) has somehow brought out those things from me.
• Capel: I shall again talk with you according to your
convenience.
• Sri Sri Thakur (smilingly): Oh yes! Whenever you like. If
anyone benefits by
talking with me, I consider myself the gainer thereby. I am
as much within me as I
am within you. If you do not become fulfilled, to the same
extent I remain
unfulfilled.
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